Interview: H.E. Isaias Afwerki, President of Eritrea with China Business Weekly Magazine
Sophia Tesfamariam
March 26, 2007
President Isaias Afwerki (PIA) held an interview with journalists from the China Business Weekly Magazine (CBWM). In his televised address broadcasted on Eritrean Television (Eri-TV) on Saturday, 17 March 2007, the President discussed about Eritrean business ventures with China, investment prospects in this country, the opportunities and challenges of doing business with China from an African point of view in general, the strategic location of Eritrea in the horn and the role it will have in the future trends of Eritrean business, role of communication and information in business and the way forward. The full text of the interview follows:
CBWM: In spite of all, Eritrea has managed to build infrastructure during very harsh time. And you as people have shown a great sense of community and a country. And you believe in this from the resistance period and then as a president of the country. How do you see all the steps Eritrea is taking all those years in terms of other countries?
PIA: I would like to say something about what we are after. We are a young nation and we have inherited a legacy of devastated country. It is a small country. We had to go in to a war of liberation almost for thirty years. You can imagine the impact of that very long war on the country. It has destroyed practically every aspect of the infrastructure, the economy but above anything else it was an opportunity lost for almost two generations in this country. So it is not only being a young nation but it is also inheriting an economy and a country that is destroyed literally. We had to start from below zero and arrive at a certain line. And to do that we had to be very cautious. We had to understand our own reality in the first place. We had to seriously consider our needs. They are not similar to the needs of other similar countries. You can speak about countries in Africa that have been independent for almost sixty years, and you can imagine like a young nation Eritrea coming out of war. To build a nation is not an easy task. For the last 15 years, we were focused only on very realistic programs. In the first place to promote development and attract investment we had to put in place an infrastructure. With out it, it is very difficult to imagine that development could take place. Any country can't attract investment without infrastructure. You can go to many countries in Africa; it is very difficult to get out of the capital city. The whole country is inaccessible, no roads, no services, no electricity, no water supply. In the first place the role of the government has to be defined very clearly. The job of the government is to create an environment conducive for development and investment by building good roads and making the country accessible by air, land and sea. Putting in place an infrastructure for airports, good port services and harbor is a necessity. Electricity is a critical element for the environment of the infrastructure as well as water supply, telecommunications etc…
Basic services are there, and the question is, “What have we done in the last 15 years?” It is not the size or the quality of the service we have done, but it should be measured in terms of time and I think we have done our best and we are not saying it is satisfactory or we have done everything, but we have done a good deal of infrastructural work for the last 15 years. And the other aspect of these facilities is, “Do we do it on our own or do we do it by outside or hired companies?” And our decision was that we build a capacity to put in place an infrastructural environment. One has to make it sustainable; it has to grow with time. One needs its own internal capacity to build roads. We decided to do that gradually, and now we have a number of qualified companies that could do the job without the intervention of external companies or expertise from outside. It is also important to note the fact that, it is less costly. With little money one can do a lot. It is very difficult to finance very huge infrastructural programs, when foreign companies are coming. In that respect I can say we have done a lot and I can say we have learned from our experience in introducing efficient means of putting in place an infrastructure.
That was one area and the other area was government. A good government which has a policy where the legal environment is attractive for investment and to perform programs domestically you have to have efficient government. We decided on lean, clean and efficient one. Lean, meaning a very small government not expensive government. One can have governments that are dysfunctional like in many parts of Africa, where there are inflated government institutions that are not effective. They take the resources of the country but don't do the job well. Clean means accountable without corruption. If corruption is there one can't do anything. There can be legal environment that is conducive but there must also be a government that is up to the responsibilities of encouraging development and promoting investment. I think it is a process. We can't say we have the best of government. It is a very young government; we need to go a long way. But our main objective is to have a clean and an efficient government equipped with all the required technology, educated people who are qualified to do their jobs, institutions that can facilitate the development of the country that guarantee good qualities of life for the people and also attract investment. And that has been one of the major preoccupations for the last 15 years, and I think we have done something on that regard which is also very important.
CBWM: You have said the type of investment that you want is somehow related to the ways the government wants to run the country, so it is not just imposing the type of investment but according to the priorities of the National Development Plan of the government.
PIA: Yes, but again one has to identify the sectors and industries. Take Tourism for example. The tourism industry is huge around here. It is not only the size or age of the country, but the potential of the country is tremendous. And then comes the question-Have we done enough to encourage tourism in this country? We are way back in putting in place of an infrastructural environment that would attract tourism. We have not exploited all the resources that we have. What we have done compared to what we need to do to put in place a tourist infrastructure is a challenging task. But we still realize that it is one potential of the country.
CBWM: How about the mining sector?
PIA: The mining sector is huge. But we have been very careful. We have heard people talk about the oil curse. The “Resource curse” I call it. If you have the resources ready, you can have companies coming from outside, exploit the resources, you can live on those resources, you don't put institutions in place. It is a matter of killing your own capacity to use those resources. Oil rich countries are rich in a way but are not developed in my opinion. Their economy and their development mayn't be sustainable. It may lead to a stagnation of development within the country. One can have the revenues of oil or gold, but if one is not in a position to exploit those resources in partnership with investors from outside that becomes an imbalanced relationship, which is not sustainable in so many ways. We know we have huge natural resources. In terms of minerals we are doing a lot of prospecting, with companies coming from outside to do the prospecting in partnership with the government in this country. We still have a lot to explore in terms of mineral resources. That is also a very huge potential which could be exploited. To exploit those resources we need to develop partnership. What I meant by infrastructure, where the resources are available will have to be accessible by road or by other means, where exploitation could be cost effective in so many ways and very sustainable. We need expertise and technology from outside. But that is not enough. We need to train our people. We need qualified people to do the job. It is also partly a program for ambitious human resources development in this country.
CBWM: This is one of the key points in your 2007 National Development Strategy. I think one of the key aspects was investment in human development as you said. Although it has been there since you were in government …
PIA: It is one of the hard ware and soft ware parts of infrastructure. The hard ware is roads, telecommunication, electricity and what have you. The soft ware is human resource capacity. Unless you have educated and qualified people you can't say well enough that we have good roads, good services etc…Without educated and skilled people it is very difficult to think of any conducive environment for development and investment. So the last 15 years, our main focus has been education and training. Have we done enough? We need a lot of time and energy to do that. We are putting in place a number of colleges. We had one university and now we have about six or seven colleges and technical schools. Illiteracy rate was very high. We have almost one fourth of the population in education. In terms of the young who are illegible for schooling, we have more than 700, 000 students who are in primary to the high school level. We need to expand that. And it is a multiplier in a way. If you have an uneducated population then it is a fixed number. If you have educated population however, then it is multiplied and serves the quality of the product. Then at the end of the day development and investment with partners will be productive. When you attract investment in tourism you need to have good trained people to participate in that industry. Agriculture, mining and all other sectors need qualified people. You can't fully depend on external expertise. That is very important. One can't underestimate the importance of highly qualified expatriate expertise. Definitely one needs to provide half of its manpower resource by training its own people. That is also one of the challenging tasks that we have been assuming in the last 15 years.
CBWM: Being a very small country in terms of population than your neighbors, is it a challenge or an advantage to pursue this specific goal as you were saying? How do you see it?
PIA: Sometimes when you have large population it becomes a liability. People speak about big populations. But they underestimate the fact that it is not numbers. It is not only the productivity of the population in one country that matters; it is also the quality of the productivity. Even in terms of market. You can talk about countries with a population of 100 million. More than 80% of the population lives below the poverty line. More than 80% or 90% are not skilled or educated. Their contribution to the economy of their country is very much limited. And in terms of market, is 100 million population a big market? I say that is not the question. The question is the purchasing power, the capacity of the population to consume commodities within the country and outside of the country. The quality of life, the standard of living of the population is what matters. At the end of the day, if any country from the outside is looking for market in Africa, do we look into the number of people or do we look into the quality of life and the quality of the economy in terms of human resources? Human resource is very critical; I say it is a soft ware that enables and multiplies the capacity of the country. It creates a very good market and develops very good partnership with outside investment. It is a guarantee for everything if you have to transfer technology and know-how. You need to have educated people to do that, it is very critical. And it is a major challenge. We have a saying here, we rather have an educated people rather than resource like oil for example. When you have educated people you have a sustainable development in a country. But if you have mineral resources or natural resources, is it sustainable? You don't have any guarantee for using that in a way of promoting growth in the economy. I would say the soft and hard wares are important. In our case we are very small population, we are more aware than countries with bigger population. Smaller populations have a tendency to focus on what they need to develop capacity in terms of know-how and technology by educating their own people. So it is an advantage to us. I say it is challenging in a way but it is also an opportunity.
CBWM: One of the things that your country is famous for is that the people are proud. In a way, they very much recognize themselves with the country they live in. It was a very long struggle but then you achieved the sense of unity. That obviously can help overcome the challenges that you face….
PIA: I don't exaggerate, but again confidence is very important. A nation needs to be confident. One of the negative outcomes of colonization in Africa has been the dehumanizing aspect of communities. People feel inferior, not confident and they are not even in a position to do things. It is not a sense of pride. It is a matter of feeling confident about one self. And you can imagine that confidence is also energy. You can have a skill, but if you are not confident definitely you have a problem. I think the quality of people we have here; people are very responsible. We say we are not corrupt, not because of good governance. But because of the culture in the population. People are not very corrupt, they are proud, they like to work. The work ethic is very encouraging, and when you add that to education and training with very confident population ready to sacrifice and to work, that I think is one good quality that any nation should have. You attract tourism with very good facilities but if you have robbery, crime, theft or unconfident people then it is very difficult to attract tourism. You can't do business with any country if there is crime. Many countries in Africa have got resources and everything but crime is a problem. People in the streets are not responsible. In some capital cities you can not even go outside after five or six in the evening. The industry is here not because of the capability of the country in terms of security, law and order; but because people are responsible. That is one good aspect. It is a comparative advantage for us to have people who are responsible at the same time very confident and ready to plan and do hard work. You can call it part of the soft ware that one can have in any nation. You have to have also good people with good government.
CBWM: The cooperation between Eritrea and China has been there for many years now and is improving day after day. These principles of self reliance and all the principles in the development of your nation have been there in China. And it has the capability of helping Eritrea in pursuing these goals. You also lived in China, so you know them very well. How do you see China coming into all of these and being instrumental to a certain way to the success of Eritrea in the long term?
PIA: China is an opportunity and a challenge for Africa. I say that in a general way, but, also here in Eritrea. The achievements in China in the last thirty years have been tremendous. Many people would like to see China is the future in terms of economy and development. I closely followed developments in China. It may not be big in terms of numbers. There are 40 million scientists in China. That was not the case thirty years ago. China produces about 350 thousand engineers every year. You can imagine that amount of resource is not easy. The change that we have seen in the last two, threes decades in terms of infrastructure, technology and industry is huge. China is becoming an economic power. China would like to say “We are underdeveloped, we are third world country, we are this and that …” I can say China is far more advancing; it may become the second biggest economy globally in a number of years. It is the growth we see and witness every day and it is inspiring in a way. We would like to see a peaceful World, a World that uses it resources efficiently. We would like to see communities and people everywhere in the World, especially in Africa to benefit from economic growth. Since we talk about globalization, I think China has become one of the dynamic forces in this globalization force that is in terms of productivity, quality of product and contribution of overall growth. That is an opportunity. An opportunity for many, because, in the last ten years we say our trade partnership was more with Europe rather than with China. Gradually it shifted because markets have ultimately their influence on how you do trade globally or regionally. And that shifted gradually because of Dubai and situations in the Middle East. Our trade relationship increased with years and shifted from Europe. We can say now we have limited relationship with Europe in terms of trade. But in the last few years dramatically everything has shifted to China.
CBWM: What are the major areas? Because, you have also relations in culture, infrastructure development, trade. What are the key areas?
PIA: It is mainly trade. In our case I would say it is machinery and technology. With huge program for infrastructural development you need to procure equipment and machinery. In the past Europe used to manufacture much of the equipment and machinery, and the markets were there. But now China is producing quality product, but also less costly. It is far, far more cheaper. In the past ten years people were saying Chinese products are poor in terms of quality. That is not true. And that has dramatically changed attitudes. And now we can say that we are almost 90% shifting to China in the procurement of equipment and machinery. Hi-tech, telecommunications companies in Europe for example have advanced a lot. China has gone a long way in this regard, the quality of the product and their prices have improved and this is an advantage. It is an opportunity for so many and we have shifted there. These are very simple examples. Talking about agricultural equipment we would like to introduce irrigated agriculture as a major form of agricultural productivity in the country. You need equipments and machinery. And you look for markets everywhere. And information is very important these days. In the last three, four decades it was very difficult. You need to make a market research, you need to make a lot of homework on where to go and buy product. These days you can have all the information on your table, you know where to buy things, you know where good quality products are available. And China is prevailing in that regard. I can say even in sophisticated technologies, China is leading in number of ways by creating ventures with companies and industrialized World. That is very important, I think. Talking about mining, the Chinese have all the technology for mining and industries are taking advantage of these resources in China. You name it. It is not only consumer goods. It is not cloth, it is not shoes. It is everything. And I think it is important for Africa. For Eritrea, maybe in the coming ten years much of the trade we do will be directly with China. After all markets are there. And competitive markets are an opportunity. And the Chinese contribution in global market is becoming an opportunity for countries like Eritrea to take advantage. Not only procuring commodities, machinery and equipments but also exchange in terms of technology transfer, know how of transfer, working together with Chinese companies in a number of areas is an opportunity, which has not been there.
CBWM: Do you have any project for instance at the moment where you really are applying this principle with any Chinese company? Any major infrastructure program or do you foresee any thing coming up very soon, where there will be major involvement?
PIA: Much of the mining industry will depend on our partnership with China. We are engaged in huge infrastructural programs and for the first time the exploitation of natural resources for the production of cement is being done with China. It may not be a big deal, but it is very important for a country like Eritrea. We are developing small manufacturing industries but again it is an advantage. I can tell you one very simple example. We have a computer assembly plant. It is a very small facility. It is not a big deal, but we get the components from China, we assemble computers here, we provide our schools and our domestic market with product from there. That was not very long time ago. We would like to develop tourism, agriculture. We are doing it with Chinese experts and Chinese technology. I believe, in the coming few years or decades the impact of that cooperation will be tremendous. If we get engaged in energy programs, mining, gold and other mineral resources with Chinese companies; it is not the option but again it is also the opportunity comparative to what Africa has seen in the last 50 years or maybe more than a century. It has been exploitation and exploitation of resources by highly developed industrialized countries, without due respect to the developing countries.
CBWM: The new thing happening in the foreign policy and trade in the last few years, this new implication of China , what should be done? Is this the right way we are going or may be we should change our approach? And may be if you can help here?
PIA: But again you have also to realize it is also a challenge. You can't say for granted that this is a good opportunity. If African countries and governments don't benefit in a good way from this opportunity, it may become a liability. There are many corrupted governments, uneducated human resources and if it is a matter of selling raw materials to China and not getting any benefit by developing a partnership for the long term, that may become a problem. Corruption in Africa is a major problem. Governments that are not accountable to their people that are not responsible, would only benefit by any partnership they have with companies or governments outside and that becomes a big problem. So it is both a challenge and an opportunity. And for Africa to be transformed in to a viable market, in its own in a viable market in a global sense, definitely that challenge should be realized very seriously. And I think even on the Chinese side China should be very careful also in dealing with African governments, in dealing with the situation in Africa. And many would say well China is coming to take the resources and loot the resources of Africa. I think that is not true, but one has to be very careful. The environment in Africa will have to change. You may realize the National People's Congress in China in these days is discussing corruption as a major problem in China. And if that flourishes and gains ground in Africa and that relationship is not based on mutual benefits on an accountability and transparency, it becomes both a liability for China and Africa. And more for Africa to be careful about on how to deal with China gain or benefit from the opportunities you have. What you have to also be very careful about the challenges that you have in developing this partnership, I say China is in a way of an opportunity but also a challenge. And governments in Africa will have to realize. In our case we say we are on the right track. We are on the right track, because we know what we need; we know what we are doing even politically. No one has any right to intervene in to the internal affairs of every country. And many would come and talk about democracy, talk about good governance in Africa, specially the Europe and the United States. Are you serious about good governance in Africa ? Are you serious about human rights? It is not true. It is not true, you have being cooperating and collaborating with corrupt governments, repressive governments in Africa. You have left Africa marginalized all this years, why now talk about it?
CBWM: And what about democracy?
PIA: Yes, democracy is very important. Democracy, meaning allowing majority of the population to participate in the politics of their country. And that is a very serious matter for African countries. And we seriously consider that as part of the software we need to develop. But that should not be polarizing society. You can not polarize society on religious ground, you can not polarize society on tribal and clan ground. We have so many examples in Africa . It is camouflaged by what people call democracy and Europeans and Americans would like to talk about democracy in Africa as a way of dividing and weakening undeveloped communities. The socio-economic transformation is very important. Unless you live at a higher level of assimilation, if you live in a tribal society, and you go for democracy in a tribal society, you get divided in to hundreds of political parties and vertical polarization is not good at all. So we need to have participation, when you have 80%, 90% of the population living below the poverty line, how can you talk about democracy? When a small minority is benefiting from the resources available to a country and the bigger majority is living in destitution, how can we talk about democracy? Democracy of destitution yes, but not democracy of equality, or democracy of sharing resources of a country. So, I think African countries will have to do a lot in this regard. They will have to go so many steps ahead, create a situation where they built nations; they get rid of all this divisive forces in society. They will have to come to an awareness where people will be educated to have the responsibility to assume in a country and the political institutions you develop in a country are also very important in terms of development and investment. I think that aspect is not neglected as far as China-Africa relationship is concerned but the good think about China is, I think it is not a deliberate disregard of the politics in a country. It is partly a lesson learned from the past. You come and intervene in a society and divide a society along its religious lines, along its tribal lines, what do you get at the end of the day? You have a weakened society or a society that is not even able to stand on its two feet. So, I think here in Eritrea we have been very careful. Of course, we have a very long political experience. We want to build a nation, not a nation divided amongst tribes, amongst religious groups, but a nation proud of it self and the people felling the unity they have among themselves and the majority of the people participate.
CBWM: Mr. President, you mentioned this computer assembling plant for example. And we know that Eritrea is logistically in a very interesting position for the Middle East and Africa and to some extent to Europe . Because you also had links, colonial reasons and other things. China in this sense might want to get access to Europe through countries like Eritrea too. So do you see Eritrea becoming also an important logistic center in a way to transformation base for all the products that might come from China and this could be another aspect like free zones or economic areas specifically catering for setting part of the world. Is that some thing that you are thinking at? Is that just one of the opportunities?
PIA: It is in fact one of the major programs of infrastructure we have. I mean any country will have to talk about its comparative advantage. And we say location for us is a comparative advantage. We are in the Northeastern part of the continent. We are on the banks of the Red Sea, which is an international water way. We could be in a location that is very strategic in terms of global trade not regional trade. And it is noting new discovered.
The Italians came to Eritrea with an idea. Of course then it was a colonial aspiration of coming to an area to colonize a big fortune because the Horn of Africa was a target for Italian colonization. But the principles have not changed. May be the philosophy of domination may have gave way to cooperation regional and international but I think the importance of the location is still there. So by putting in place a very good infrastructure and services for handling, we need a free zone, we are building on that. We need a very good harbor, we need a very good communications network and infrastructure and that could be an opportunity for regional and global market. If we put that in place as one of our ambitious program for infrastructure, not infrastructure for domestic purposes, we may not be in a position now to talk about an infrastructure that would be useful in global trade but we need to have an infrastructure for regional trade. If we can develop a regional arrangement for cooperation amongst the nations in this region; you have the Middle East, the Red Sea is the very important linkage, it is also good that we have this facility now, we have so many advantages to think about the future for exploiting the location of Eritrea . At one area we were discussing with friends because sea route is one but again China is also a partner in developing this facility. We may need some time. As I said earlier, it is too early to say there is a lot of competition. Every body wants to be a center for a region. It is good that we have this attitude. Ultimately markets are competition. You compete with your partner, you compete with your competitor and finally the best service, the best product prevails. Can we do that? I don't want to be very presumptuous, but we have to be able to compete in a global and regional market. How we can compete? We need to exploit this location and the location could be exploited by the endeavors we are doing in terms of harvest not only one but more than one harvest, a very good infrastructure for tourism, handling a very efficient and good airport in the coastal areas. All those definitely will enable us to exploit this comparative advantage of our location along the Red Sea . And China is a major partner. You can imagine what we buy in Dubai or the regional market, much of the product comes from China . So, re-export of products, Chinese products from these ports is there. So, do we need to do that? Yes in a way, but time will have to tell us and time is a very, very important thing. If we sit idle and not exploit this location as an advantage for us, then we are not doing the right thing. So I think doing what we are doing now even the very modest and definitely will take us to a phase or we could be a regional hub for re-export or even processing the commodities mentioned like this small facility for computer assembling, we would like to expand that part of facility. We don't have the ambition of manufacturing components; we can not be competitive in manufacturing components that doesn't makes sense at all, but we can be a very good assembling facility here. We are also considering manufacturing. It is not only components of computers and assembling computers but equipments and machinery. We can do that.
CBWM: Eritrea is a young nation. You have been actually very much involved in history of this young nation. How do you see Eritrea with in the next five to six years or up to ten years of time? How do you like to see your country? How do you imagine your country?
PIA: We say we are on the right track. But the environment may not be helpful, it is a challenge. The regional environment is not helpful. I don't want to talk about politics, Sudan, Ethiopia, the border issue, Somalia, Kenya, and Uganda. I don't want to talk about these at the moment but that again is a challenge. It is a reality we have to overcome. We would have like to have a peaceful and stable environment in the region which would be beneficial and the benefits could be to every one of us in the region. And we could have moved faster at a higher speed and we could have achieved a lot. We know that is a problem that is an obstacle. But our realization of this problem has become a challenge to us and we are doing an increased effort to overcome this difficulty in terms of what we can be in a matter of ten years. In spite of all the obstacles, all the challenges, in spite of the fact that we inherited a devastated economy, what we are doing on our own and what we have achieved in a very short period of time could give us an insight on what we can be in a matter of ten years. I can assure you, size is not very important. The most important thing is on what you do in terms of developing human resources, in terms of putting an infrastructure, in terms of creating an environment for gross development and investment. If we can exploit again the natural resources we have effectively, we could be one of the wealthiest nations in the Horn of Africa.
Per capita we could be the wealthiest, I am quiet sure and I am confident we could be the wealthiest. Now of course the reality is not as promising as one can see, but if we can implement programs impacting on the economy of this country and if regional and global circumstances help in a way, definitely with all the drive we have now and the qualities we mentioned earlier about responsible people, hard working people, confident people, you can imagine that. I may not quantitatively say but qualitatively we will be not less than any advanced country in the region. Even the oil rich countries, we may not brag about being as wealthy as those countries per capital. But generally speaking we will be one of the major economic units in this region.
CBWM: The Chinese today are actually investing outside; they are setting an agency for foreign investment. What would you tell especially to the Chinese Investor that reads this article?
PIA: I think it is true to say that Chinese investors had been shy. The Chinese Government has been very shy. They have this ambitious motto of going global. They would like to go global. Now they have realized their potential. They are in a position now to go global. And these recent initiatives on the China-Africa relationship, the fact that the Chinese Government sees Africa as a major market, potential market for the future, a continent with tremendous resources, a continent that could develop to become a big market and I think that attitude and understanding on the part of Chinese Government, Chinese investors is very important. They are now more outward looking and confident to invest outside China. Of course China's size is a liability. You have a big market, you have a big work force, you have every thing there. In China you can think about producing a commodity and selling it in China , you don't need to go outside to sell that product. So that may have become a liability, but I think the awareness now for Chinese to global is very important. I can't say the Chinese have clearly identified the potential seriously. They need to be more outgoing.
If you talk about Eritrea they may be seeing the tip of the iceberg now. But with time definitely they would learn more about the opportunities for investment in this country. Not only in Eritrea but the whole region. I can see now their drive in getting involved in so many projects with in the region outside Eritrea , which is good for us we say. We say it is good because if Chinese come and invest in this areas they get to know more and they get involved more. And with all the resources they have you can imagine the momentum that could be created by huge Chinese investment. So I would encourage Chinese investors.
CBWM: As you said at first the Chinese investors were more cautious at the beginning. But now with time as you said, they have started to go outside and this region is developing. And they will come with more confidence, unless…?
PIA: Yes it is a bit competitive now. I mean when you go in to Europe and the United States, it is not the politics. You should bother about politics of course. Politicians in the United States and Europe are very much scared, of course divided; some would like to go for alliance with China, some would like to compete with China, many have realized it is not good to compete; it is good to go for alliance. I know so many companies in Europe that had moved to China reproducing what ever they sell every where in the world by moving in China because of the advantages they have there; labor, a quality of skills are there as an advantage. For China to come to Africa is also for European and American companies coming in joint venture with Chinese companies, which I believe in spite of the politics the investment of Chinese companies in Africa is going to be one of the driving forces for growth in the economy, for enabling Africa to be a market or a partner. We can say Africa is marginalized, but the coming of the Chinese and investment growing would create a very big momentum.
It is good to see your position in this equation. It is a very complex equation but again we believe with our modest resources we could play a very significant role in transforming our economy but also working with our partners in the region to attract more of Chinese investment, more of Chinese involvement in all sectors ultimately. I think there wouldn't be any isolated national economy in the region and out side the region. And see Chinese investment in a perspective where globalization will take a form, a completely different form, the quality of life, the situation in so many underdeveloped countries in Africa will have to be transformed. And it is not the immediate benefit China can get or the country having partners with China, but the long term impact for generations to come in the sustainability of these relationship is quiet important. And I am very optimistic in that regard. If we take the opportunity and take the chances and go the right direction, we don't need to go the wrong direction though. I believe that aspect of China-Eritrea relationship, China-Africa relationship will have a very significant impact for generations to come.
CBWM: We try to be a communication tool between countries and as you said bring an understanding to send a meeting point between one another…
PIA: It is a very important. Because, recently I was in this China-Africa Conference, I was asked about this. Of course people are very concerned about the negative publicity about China's intentions in Africa. Yes, you need to be careful, but again that negative publicity should not inhibit people from doing business with China. It is a reality, you can't escape that reality. But when you get more information you can make the right decision and that is very helpful, especially for Africa not for China. I say, better informed Africa will do good business with China rather than better informed Chinese doing good business, even though that is also very important.
Thank you!
CBWM: In spite of all, Eritrea has managed to build infrastructure during very harsh time. And you as people have shown a great sense of community and a country. And you believe in this from the resistance period and then as a president of the country. How do you see all the steps Eritrea is taking all those years in terms of other countries?
PIA: I would like to say something about what we are after. We are a young nation and we have inherited a legacy of devastated country. It is a small country. We had to go in to a war of liberation almost for thirty years. You can imagine the impact of that very long war on the country. It has destroyed practically every aspect of the infrastructure, the economy but above anything else it was an opportunity lost for almost two generations in this country. So it is not only being a young nation but it is also inheriting an economy and a country that is destroyed literally. We had to start from below zero and arrive at a certain line. And to do that we had to be very cautious. We had to understand our own reality in the first place. We had to seriously consider our needs. They are not similar to the needs of other similar countries. You can speak about countries in Africa that have been independent for almost sixty years, and you can imagine like a young nation Eritrea coming out of war. To build a nation is not an easy task. For the last 15 years, we were focused only on very realistic programs. In the first place to promote development and attract investment we had to put in place an infrastructure. With out it, it is very difficult to imagine that development could take place. Any country can't attract investment without infrastructure. You can go to many countries in Africa; it is very difficult to get out of the capital city. The whole country is inaccessible, no roads, no services, no electricity, no water supply. In the first place the role of the government has to be defined very clearly. The job of the government is to create an environment conducive for development and investment by building good roads and making the country accessible by air, land and sea. Putting in place an infrastructure for airports, good port services and harbor is a necessity. Electricity is a critical element for the environment of the infrastructure as well as water supply, telecommunications etc…
Basic services are there, and the question is, “What have we done in the last 15 years?” It is not the size or the quality of the service we have done, but it should be measured in terms of time and I think we have done our best and we are not saying it is satisfactory or we have done everything, but we have done a good deal of infrastructural work for the last 15 years. And the other aspect of these facilities is, “Do we do it on our own or do we do it by outside or hired companies?” And our decision was that we build a capacity to put in place an infrastructural environment. One has to make it sustainable; it has to grow with time. One needs its own internal capacity to build roads. We decided to do that gradually, and now we have a number of qualified companies that could do the job without the intervention of external companies or expertise from outside. It is also important to note the fact that, it is less costly. With little money one can do a lot. It is very difficult to finance very huge infrastructural programs, when foreign companies are coming. In that respect I can say we have done a lot and I can say we have learned from our experience in introducing efficient means of putting in place an infrastructure.
That was one area and the other area was government. A good government which has a policy where the legal environment is attractive for investment and to perform programs domestically you have to have efficient government. We decided on lean, clean and efficient one. Lean, meaning a very small government not expensive government. One can have governments that are dysfunctional like in many parts of Africa, where there are inflated government institutions that are not effective. They take the resources of the country but don't do the job well. Clean means accountable without corruption. If corruption is there one can't do anything. There can be legal environment that is conducive but there must also be a government that is up to the responsibilities of encouraging development and promoting investment. I think it is a process. We can't say we have the best of government. It is a very young government; we need to go a long way. But our main objective is to have a clean and an efficient government equipped with all the required technology, educated people who are qualified to do their jobs, institutions that can facilitate the development of the country that guarantee good qualities of life for the people and also attract investment. And that has been one of the major preoccupations for the last 15 years, and I think we have done something on that regard which is also very important.
CBWM: You have said the type of investment that you want is somehow related to the ways the government wants to run the country, so it is not just imposing the type of investment but according to the priorities of the National Development Plan of the government.
PIA: Yes, but again one has to identify the sectors and industries. Take Tourism for example. The tourism industry is huge around here. It is not only the size or age of the country, but the potential of the country is tremendous. And then comes the question-Have we done enough to encourage tourism in this country? We are way back in putting in place of an infrastructural environment that would attract tourism. We have not exploited all the resources that we have. What we have done compared to what we need to do to put in place a tourist infrastructure is a challenging task. But we still realize that it is one potential of the country.
CBWM: How about the mining sector?
PIA: The mining sector is huge. But we have been very careful. We have heard people talk about the oil curse. The “Resource curse” I call it. If you have the resources ready, you can have companies coming from outside, exploit the resources, you can live on those resources, you don't put institutions in place. It is a matter of killing your own capacity to use those resources. Oil rich countries are rich in a way but are not developed in my opinion. Their economy and their development mayn't be sustainable. It may lead to a stagnation of development within the country. One can have the revenues of oil or gold, but if one is not in a position to exploit those resources in partnership with investors from outside that becomes an imbalanced relationship, which is not sustainable in so many ways. We know we have huge natural resources. In terms of minerals we are doing a lot of prospecting, with companies coming from outside to do the prospecting in partnership with the government in this country. We still have a lot to explore in terms of mineral resources. That is also a very huge potential which could be exploited. To exploit those resources we need to develop partnership. What I meant by infrastructure, where the resources are available will have to be accessible by road or by other means, where exploitation could be cost effective in so many ways and very sustainable. We need expertise and technology from outside. But that is not enough. We need to train our people. We need qualified people to do the job. It is also partly a program for ambitious human resources development in this country.
CBWM: This is one of the key points in your 2007 National Development Strategy. I think one of the key aspects was investment in human development as you said. Although it has been there since you were in government …
PIA: It is one of the hard ware and soft ware parts of infrastructure. The hard ware is roads, telecommunication, electricity and what have you. The soft ware is human resource capacity. Unless you have educated and qualified people you can't say well enough that we have good roads, good services etc…Without educated and skilled people it is very difficult to think of any conducive environment for development and investment. So the last 15 years, our main focus has been education and training. Have we done enough? We need a lot of time and energy to do that. We are putting in place a number of colleges. We had one university and now we have about six or seven colleges and technical schools. Illiteracy rate was very high. We have almost one fourth of the population in education. In terms of the young who are illegible for schooling, we have more than 700, 000 students who are in primary to the high school level. We need to expand that. And it is a multiplier in a way. If you have an uneducated population then it is a fixed number. If you have educated population however, then it is multiplied and serves the quality of the product. Then at the end of the day development and investment with partners will be productive. When you attract investment in tourism you need to have good trained people to participate in that industry. Agriculture, mining and all other sectors need qualified people. You can't fully depend on external expertise. That is very important. One can't underestimate the importance of highly qualified expatriate expertise. Definitely one needs to provide half of its manpower resource by training its own people. That is also one of the challenging tasks that we have been assuming in the last 15 years.
CBWM: Being a very small country in terms of population than your neighbors, is it a challenge or an advantage to pursue this specific goal as you were saying? How do you see it?
PIA: Sometimes when you have large population it becomes a liability. People speak about big populations. But they underestimate the fact that it is not numbers. It is not only the productivity of the population in one country that matters; it is also the quality of the productivity. Even in terms of market. You can talk about countries with a population of 100 million. More than 80% of the population lives below the poverty line. More than 80% or 90% are not skilled or educated. Their contribution to the economy of their country is very much limited. And in terms of market, is 100 million population a big market? I say that is not the question. The question is the purchasing power, the capacity of the population to consume commodities within the country and outside of the country. The quality of life, the standard of living of the population is what matters. At the end of the day, if any country from the outside is looking for market in Africa, do we look into the number of people or do we look into the quality of life and the quality of the economy in terms of human resources? Human resource is very critical; I say it is a soft ware that enables and multiplies the capacity of the country. It creates a very good market and develops very good partnership with outside investment. It is a guarantee for everything if you have to transfer technology and know-how. You need to have educated people to do that, it is very critical. And it is a major challenge. We have a saying here, we rather have an educated people rather than resource like oil for example. When you have educated people you have a sustainable development in a country. But if you have mineral resources or natural resources, is it sustainable? You don't have any guarantee for using that in a way of promoting growth in the economy. I would say the soft and hard wares are important. In our case we are very small population, we are more aware than countries with bigger population. Smaller populations have a tendency to focus on what they need to develop capacity in terms of know-how and technology by educating their own people. So it is an advantage to us. I say it is challenging in a way but it is also an opportunity.
CBWM: One of the things that your country is famous for is that the people are proud. In a way, they very much recognize themselves with the country they live in. It was a very long struggle but then you achieved the sense of unity. That obviously can help overcome the challenges that you face….
PIA: I don't exaggerate, but again confidence is very important. A nation needs to be confident. One of the negative outcomes of colonization in Africa has been the dehumanizing aspect of communities. People feel inferior, not confident and they are not even in a position to do things. It is not a sense of pride. It is a matter of feeling confident about one self. And you can imagine that confidence is also energy. You can have a skill, but if you are not confident definitely you have a problem. I think the quality of people we have here; people are very responsible. We say we are not corrupt, not because of good governance. But because of the culture in the population. People are not very corrupt, they are proud, they like to work. The work ethic is very encouraging, and when you add that to education and training with very confident population ready to sacrifice and to work, that I think is one good quality that any nation should have. You attract tourism with very good facilities but if you have robbery, crime, theft or unconfident people then it is very difficult to attract tourism. You can't do business with any country if there is crime. Many countries in Africa have got resources and everything but crime is a problem. People in the streets are not responsible. In some capital cities you can not even go outside after five or six in the evening. The industry is here not because of the capability of the country in terms of security, law and order; but because people are responsible. That is one good aspect. It is a comparative advantage for us to have people who are responsible at the same time very confident and ready to plan and do hard work. You can call it part of the soft ware that one can have in any nation. You have to have also good people with good government.
CBWM: The cooperation between Eritrea and China has been there for many years now and is improving day after day. These principles of self reliance and all the principles in the development of your nation have been there in China. And it has the capability of helping Eritrea in pursuing these goals. You also lived in China, so you know them very well. How do you see China coming into all of these and being instrumental to a certain way to the success of Eritrea in the long term?
PIA: China is an opportunity and a challenge for Africa. I say that in a general way, but, also here in Eritrea. The achievements in China in the last thirty years have been tremendous. Many people would like to see China is the future in terms of economy and development. I closely followed developments in China. It may not be big in terms of numbers. There are 40 million scientists in China. That was not the case thirty years ago. China produces about 350 thousand engineers every year. You can imagine that amount of resource is not easy. The change that we have seen in the last two, threes decades in terms of infrastructure, technology and industry is huge. China is becoming an economic power. China would like to say “We are underdeveloped, we are third world country, we are this and that …” I can say China is far more advancing; it may become the second biggest economy globally in a number of years. It is the growth we see and witness every day and it is inspiring in a way. We would like to see a peaceful World, a World that uses it resources efficiently. We would like to see communities and people everywhere in the World, especially in Africa to benefit from economic growth. Since we talk about globalization, I think China has become one of the dynamic forces in this globalization force that is in terms of productivity, quality of product and contribution of overall growth. That is an opportunity. An opportunity for many, because, in the last ten years we say our trade partnership was more with Europe rather than with China. Gradually it shifted because markets have ultimately their influence on how you do trade globally or regionally. And that shifted gradually because of Dubai and situations in the Middle East. Our trade relationship increased with years and shifted from Europe. We can say now we have limited relationship with Europe in terms of trade. But in the last few years dramatically everything has shifted to China.
CBWM: What are the major areas? Because, you have also relations in culture, infrastructure development, trade. What are the key areas?
PIA: It is mainly trade. In our case I would say it is machinery and technology. With huge program for infrastructural development you need to procure equipment and machinery. In the past Europe used to manufacture much of the equipment and machinery, and the markets were there. But now China is producing quality product, but also less costly. It is far, far more cheaper. In the past ten years people were saying Chinese products are poor in terms of quality. That is not true. And that has dramatically changed attitudes. And now we can say that we are almost 90% shifting to China in the procurement of equipment and machinery. Hi-tech, telecommunications companies in Europe for example have advanced a lot. China has gone a long way in this regard, the quality of the product and their prices have improved and this is an advantage. It is an opportunity for so many and we have shifted there. These are very simple examples. Talking about agricultural equipment we would like to introduce irrigated agriculture as a major form of agricultural productivity in the country. You need equipments and machinery. And you look for markets everywhere. And information is very important these days. In the last three, four decades it was very difficult. You need to make a market research, you need to make a lot of homework on where to go and buy product. These days you can have all the information on your table, you know where to buy things, you know where good quality products are available. And China is prevailing in that regard. I can say even in sophisticated technologies, China is leading in number of ways by creating ventures with companies and industrialized World. That is very important, I think. Talking about mining, the Chinese have all the technology for mining and industries are taking advantage of these resources in China. You name it. It is not only consumer goods. It is not cloth, it is not shoes. It is everything. And I think it is important for Africa. For Eritrea, maybe in the coming ten years much of the trade we do will be directly with China. After all markets are there. And competitive markets are an opportunity. And the Chinese contribution in global market is becoming an opportunity for countries like Eritrea to take advantage. Not only procuring commodities, machinery and equipments but also exchange in terms of technology transfer, know how of transfer, working together with Chinese companies in a number of areas is an opportunity, which has not been there.
CBWM: Do you have any project for instance at the moment where you really are applying this principle with any Chinese company? Any major infrastructure program or do you foresee any thing coming up very soon, where there will be major involvement?
PIA: Much of the mining industry will depend on our partnership with China. We are engaged in huge infrastructural programs and for the first time the exploitation of natural resources for the production of cement is being done with China. It may not be a big deal, but it is very important for a country like Eritrea. We are developing small manufacturing industries but again it is an advantage. I can tell you one very simple example. We have a computer assembly plant. It is a very small facility. It is not a big deal, but we get the components from China, we assemble computers here, we provide our schools and our domestic market with product from there. That was not very long time ago. We would like to develop tourism, agriculture. We are doing it with Chinese experts and Chinese technology. I believe, in the coming few years or decades the impact of that cooperation will be tremendous. If we get engaged in energy programs, mining, gold and other mineral resources with Chinese companies; it is not the option but again it is also the opportunity comparative to what Africa has seen in the last 50 years or maybe more than a century. It has been exploitation and exploitation of resources by highly developed industrialized countries, without due respect to the developing countries.
CBWM: The new thing happening in the foreign policy and trade in the last few years, this new implication of China , what should be done? Is this the right way we are going or may be we should change our approach? And may be if you can help here?
PIA: But again you have also to realize it is also a challenge. You can't say for granted that this is a good opportunity. If African countries and governments don't benefit in a good way from this opportunity, it may become a liability. There are many corrupted governments, uneducated human resources and if it is a matter of selling raw materials to China and not getting any benefit by developing a partnership for the long term, that may become a problem. Corruption in Africa is a major problem. Governments that are not accountable to their people that are not responsible, would only benefit by any partnership they have with companies or governments outside and that becomes a big problem. So it is both a challenge and an opportunity. And for Africa to be transformed in to a viable market, in its own in a viable market in a global sense, definitely that challenge should be realized very seriously. And I think even on the Chinese side China should be very careful also in dealing with African governments, in dealing with the situation in Africa. And many would say well China is coming to take the resources and loot the resources of Africa. I think that is not true, but one has to be very careful. The environment in Africa will have to change. You may realize the National People's Congress in China in these days is discussing corruption as a major problem in China. And if that flourishes and gains ground in Africa and that relationship is not based on mutual benefits on an accountability and transparency, it becomes both a liability for China and Africa. And more for Africa to be careful about on how to deal with China gain or benefit from the opportunities you have. What you have to also be very careful about the challenges that you have in developing this partnership, I say China is in a way of an opportunity but also a challenge. And governments in Africa will have to realize. In our case we say we are on the right track. We are on the right track, because we know what we need; we know what we are doing even politically. No one has any right to intervene in to the internal affairs of every country. And many would come and talk about democracy, talk about good governance in Africa, specially the Europe and the United States. Are you serious about good governance in Africa ? Are you serious about human rights? It is not true. It is not true, you have being cooperating and collaborating with corrupt governments, repressive governments in Africa. You have left Africa marginalized all this years, why now talk about it?
CBWM: And what about democracy?
PIA: Yes, democracy is very important. Democracy, meaning allowing majority of the population to participate in the politics of their country. And that is a very serious matter for African countries. And we seriously consider that as part of the software we need to develop. But that should not be polarizing society. You can not polarize society on religious ground, you can not polarize society on tribal and clan ground. We have so many examples in Africa . It is camouflaged by what people call democracy and Europeans and Americans would like to talk about democracy in Africa as a way of dividing and weakening undeveloped communities. The socio-economic transformation is very important. Unless you live at a higher level of assimilation, if you live in a tribal society, and you go for democracy in a tribal society, you get divided in to hundreds of political parties and vertical polarization is not good at all. So we need to have participation, when you have 80%, 90% of the population living below the poverty line, how can you talk about democracy? When a small minority is benefiting from the resources available to a country and the bigger majority is living in destitution, how can we talk about democracy? Democracy of destitution yes, but not democracy of equality, or democracy of sharing resources of a country. So, I think African countries will have to do a lot in this regard. They will have to go so many steps ahead, create a situation where they built nations; they get rid of all this divisive forces in society. They will have to come to an awareness where people will be educated to have the responsibility to assume in a country and the political institutions you develop in a country are also very important in terms of development and investment. I think that aspect is not neglected as far as China-Africa relationship is concerned but the good think about China is, I think it is not a deliberate disregard of the politics in a country. It is partly a lesson learned from the past. You come and intervene in a society and divide a society along its religious lines, along its tribal lines, what do you get at the end of the day? You have a weakened society or a society that is not even able to stand on its two feet. So, I think here in Eritrea we have been very careful. Of course, we have a very long political experience. We want to build a nation, not a nation divided amongst tribes, amongst religious groups, but a nation proud of it self and the people felling the unity they have among themselves and the majority of the people participate.
CBWM: Mr. President, you mentioned this computer assembling plant for example. And we know that Eritrea is logistically in a very interesting position for the Middle East and Africa and to some extent to Europe . Because you also had links, colonial reasons and other things. China in this sense might want to get access to Europe through countries like Eritrea too. So do you see Eritrea becoming also an important logistic center in a way to transformation base for all the products that might come from China and this could be another aspect like free zones or economic areas specifically catering for setting part of the world. Is that some thing that you are thinking at? Is that just one of the opportunities?
PIA: It is in fact one of the major programs of infrastructure we have. I mean any country will have to talk about its comparative advantage. And we say location for us is a comparative advantage. We are in the Northeastern part of the continent. We are on the banks of the Red Sea, which is an international water way. We could be in a location that is very strategic in terms of global trade not regional trade. And it is noting new discovered.
The Italians came to Eritrea with an idea. Of course then it was a colonial aspiration of coming to an area to colonize a big fortune because the Horn of Africa was a target for Italian colonization. But the principles have not changed. May be the philosophy of domination may have gave way to cooperation regional and international but I think the importance of the location is still there. So by putting in place a very good infrastructure and services for handling, we need a free zone, we are building on that. We need a very good harbor, we need a very good communications network and infrastructure and that could be an opportunity for regional and global market. If we put that in place as one of our ambitious program for infrastructure, not infrastructure for domestic purposes, we may not be in a position now to talk about an infrastructure that would be useful in global trade but we need to have an infrastructure for regional trade. If we can develop a regional arrangement for cooperation amongst the nations in this region; you have the Middle East, the Red Sea is the very important linkage, it is also good that we have this facility now, we have so many advantages to think about the future for exploiting the location of Eritrea . At one area we were discussing with friends because sea route is one but again China is also a partner in developing this facility. We may need some time. As I said earlier, it is too early to say there is a lot of competition. Every body wants to be a center for a region. It is good that we have this attitude. Ultimately markets are competition. You compete with your partner, you compete with your competitor and finally the best service, the best product prevails. Can we do that? I don't want to be very presumptuous, but we have to be able to compete in a global and regional market. How we can compete? We need to exploit this location and the location could be exploited by the endeavors we are doing in terms of harvest not only one but more than one harvest, a very good infrastructure for tourism, handling a very efficient and good airport in the coastal areas. All those definitely will enable us to exploit this comparative advantage of our location along the Red Sea . And China is a major partner. You can imagine what we buy in Dubai or the regional market, much of the product comes from China . So, re-export of products, Chinese products from these ports is there. So, do we need to do that? Yes in a way, but time will have to tell us and time is a very, very important thing. If we sit idle and not exploit this location as an advantage for us, then we are not doing the right thing. So I think doing what we are doing now even the very modest and definitely will take us to a phase or we could be a regional hub for re-export or even processing the commodities mentioned like this small facility for computer assembling, we would like to expand that part of facility. We don't have the ambition of manufacturing components; we can not be competitive in manufacturing components that doesn't makes sense at all, but we can be a very good assembling facility here. We are also considering manufacturing. It is not only components of computers and assembling computers but equipments and machinery. We can do that.
CBWM: Eritrea is a young nation. You have been actually very much involved in history of this young nation. How do you see Eritrea with in the next five to six years or up to ten years of time? How do you like to see your country? How do you imagine your country?
PIA: We say we are on the right track. But the environment may not be helpful, it is a challenge. The regional environment is not helpful. I don't want to talk about politics, Sudan, Ethiopia, the border issue, Somalia, Kenya, and Uganda. I don't want to talk about these at the moment but that again is a challenge. It is a reality we have to overcome. We would have like to have a peaceful and stable environment in the region which would be beneficial and the benefits could be to every one of us in the region. And we could have moved faster at a higher speed and we could have achieved a lot. We know that is a problem that is an obstacle. But our realization of this problem has become a challenge to us and we are doing an increased effort to overcome this difficulty in terms of what we can be in a matter of ten years. In spite of all the obstacles, all the challenges, in spite of the fact that we inherited a devastated economy, what we are doing on our own and what we have achieved in a very short period of time could give us an insight on what we can be in a matter of ten years. I can assure you, size is not very important. The most important thing is on what you do in terms of developing human resources, in terms of putting an infrastructure, in terms of creating an environment for gross development and investment. If we can exploit again the natural resources we have effectively, we could be one of the wealthiest nations in the Horn of Africa.
Per capita we could be the wealthiest, I am quiet sure and I am confident we could be the wealthiest. Now of course the reality is not as promising as one can see, but if we can implement programs impacting on the economy of this country and if regional and global circumstances help in a way, definitely with all the drive we have now and the qualities we mentioned earlier about responsible people, hard working people, confident people, you can imagine that. I may not quantitatively say but qualitatively we will be not less than any advanced country in the region. Even the oil rich countries, we may not brag about being as wealthy as those countries per capital. But generally speaking we will be one of the major economic units in this region.
CBWM: The Chinese today are actually investing outside; they are setting an agency for foreign investment. What would you tell especially to the Chinese Investor that reads this article?
PIA: I think it is true to say that Chinese investors had been shy. The Chinese Government has been very shy. They have this ambitious motto of going global. They would like to go global. Now they have realized their potential. They are in a position now to go global. And these recent initiatives on the China-Africa relationship, the fact that the Chinese Government sees Africa as a major market, potential market for the future, a continent with tremendous resources, a continent that could develop to become a big market and I think that attitude and understanding on the part of Chinese Government, Chinese investors is very important. They are now more outward looking and confident to invest outside China. Of course China's size is a liability. You have a big market, you have a big work force, you have every thing there. In China you can think about producing a commodity and selling it in China , you don't need to go outside to sell that product. So that may have become a liability, but I think the awareness now for Chinese to global is very important. I can't say the Chinese have clearly identified the potential seriously. They need to be more outgoing.
If you talk about Eritrea they may be seeing the tip of the iceberg now. But with time definitely they would learn more about the opportunities for investment in this country. Not only in Eritrea but the whole region. I can see now their drive in getting involved in so many projects with in the region outside Eritrea , which is good for us we say. We say it is good because if Chinese come and invest in this areas they get to know more and they get involved more. And with all the resources they have you can imagine the momentum that could be created by huge Chinese investment. So I would encourage Chinese investors.
CBWM: As you said at first the Chinese investors were more cautious at the beginning. But now with time as you said, they have started to go outside and this region is developing. And they will come with more confidence, unless…?
PIA: Yes it is a bit competitive now. I mean when you go in to Europe and the United States, it is not the politics. You should bother about politics of course. Politicians in the United States and Europe are very much scared, of course divided; some would like to go for alliance with China, some would like to compete with China, many have realized it is not good to compete; it is good to go for alliance. I know so many companies in Europe that had moved to China reproducing what ever they sell every where in the world by moving in China because of the advantages they have there; labor, a quality of skills are there as an advantage. For China to come to Africa is also for European and American companies coming in joint venture with Chinese companies, which I believe in spite of the politics the investment of Chinese companies in Africa is going to be one of the driving forces for growth in the economy, for enabling Africa to be a market or a partner. We can say Africa is marginalized, but the coming of the Chinese and investment growing would create a very big momentum.
It is good to see your position in this equation. It is a very complex equation but again we believe with our modest resources we could play a very significant role in transforming our economy but also working with our partners in the region to attract more of Chinese investment, more of Chinese involvement in all sectors ultimately. I think there wouldn't be any isolated national economy in the region and out side the region. And see Chinese investment in a perspective where globalization will take a form, a completely different form, the quality of life, the situation in so many underdeveloped countries in Africa will have to be transformed. And it is not the immediate benefit China can get or the country having partners with China, but the long term impact for generations to come in the sustainability of these relationship is quiet important. And I am very optimistic in that regard. If we take the opportunity and take the chances and go the right direction, we don't need to go the wrong direction though. I believe that aspect of China-Eritrea relationship, China-Africa relationship will have a very significant impact for generations to come.
CBWM: We try to be a communication tool between countries and as you said bring an understanding to send a meeting point between one another…
PIA: It is a very important. Because, recently I was in this China-Africa Conference, I was asked about this. Of course people are very concerned about the negative publicity about China's intentions in Africa. Yes, you need to be careful, but again that negative publicity should not inhibit people from doing business with China. It is a reality, you can't escape that reality. But when you get more information you can make the right decision and that is very helpful, especially for Africa not for China. I say, better informed Africa will do good business with China rather than better informed Chinese doing good business, even though that is also very important.
Thank you!
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